UK Snap Election 2017

Which party do you support?

Conservatives/Tories- Largest party in Parliament and originallly seen as potentially the only viable party after Brexit. Many, including myself, saw a "one party state" arising due to a lack of opposition. Tories today are keen on Brexit (but split between a "soft" or "hard" brexit) and Theresa May's time as PM might come to an end if and when her minority government falls apart (I suspect by the end of the year).

Labour- Jeremy Corbyn basically did a hostile takeover of this party bringing in tens o thousands of new voters and pushing it the the far left. They are calling for nationalizing industries and railways, a maximum wage, increasing the minimum wage, etc

Liberal-Dems: insignificant little buggers. They are basically Labour. When labour goes center-left, Liberal gems go far left, and vice versa. They maintained a coalition government with Camerons government but were later decimated in the 2014 general elections

UKIP- Brexiteers basically. UKIP has lost all of its seats now, most voters have flocked to the Tories. Its leader has resigned today

SNP- Basically Labour who want Scotland to be an independent party

DUP- an Irish Unionist party now in coalition with the Tories.

Sinn Féin- Irish Nationalist party that came close to having a majority in their devolved parliament.


****I will add more information on this, I am just busy right now but want to ge a jump start on this****

Voting for Labour helps create nationalism while voting for the Tories will only stagnate nationalism.

Labour sounds like the beginning stages of communism. Death is a preferable alternative to communism. - Liberty Prime(again)

كتب بواسطة Helly, 09.06.2017 at 14:12

Labour sounds like the beginning stages of communism. Death is a preferable alternative to communism. - Liberty Prime(again)

Poison is Poison, rather take it quickly to invoke a reaction than to take it slowly and then die with no idea as of why.

كتب بواسطة Tundy, 09.06.2017 at 14:22

كتب بواسطة Helly, 09.06.2017 at 14:12

Labour sounds like the beginning stages of communism. Death is a preferable alternative to communism. - Liberty Prime(again)

Poison is Poison, rather take it quickly to invoke a reaction than to take it slowly and then die with no idea as of why.

I still believe real treatments exsist in this world of snake oil salesmen tunder :-)

Ukeep out of my country you greast idiot

The idea of instituing a maximum wage, as Labour defends, isn't bad at all, altough there'd be some concern that it could trigger a lack of motivation on entrepeneurs and private sector..

Remember Spain for the whole of 2016 and a part of 2017 with a Conservative management government all over again? It'll happen exactly the same in Britain and in the end, Britain will have another Conservative government, just like in Spain.
Unless Labour turns a bit right, they'll just keep on imploding, or be a party of millenials.

We've had that issue in Portugal sort of with our Socialist Party, when they turned too much to the left, from 2005 to 2011, which led to a hard recession, they almost imploded and it took them 4 years (a full legislature) and 2 leadership elections to get them back into a ("contraption") government with Communists and Radical Leftists.

كتب بواسطة Al Fappino, 09.06.2017 at 16:05

The idea of instituing a maximum wage, as Labour defends, isn't bad at all, altough there'd be some concern that it could trigger a lack of motivation on entrepeneurs and private sector..

Maximum wage will result in two effects

1. No one will have any incentive to make more than whatever the threshold is. Sure, you could argue they could invest more, maybe raise wages, etc. but for th most part they will simply stop caring, especially entrepreneurs. They will have ZERO incentive to expand their businesses if every extra penny they make is then taken from them by an outside force

2. Millionaires and billionaires will simply leave the country along with all of their money and wealth and invest it elsewhere. There's a term for this, capital flight, that is found primarily in left-leaning nations (only makes since as it is left-leaning countries that target their wealth). This can lead to a currency collapsing and the brain drain that results will destroy the nation (just take a look at Puerto Rico [not a country] or Venezuela [china has also experienced this])

You can't multiply wealth by dividing it

كتب بواسطة Pheonixking929, 09.06.2017 at 16:11

كتب بواسطة Al Fappino, 09.06.2017 at 16:05

The idea of instituing a maximum wage, as Labour defends, isn't bad at all, altough there'd be some concern that it could trigger a lack of motivation on entrepeneurs and private sector..

Maximum wage will result in two effects

1. No one will have any incentive to make more than whatever the threshold is. Sure, you could argue they could invest more, maybe raise wages, etc. but for th most part they will simply stop caring, especially entrepreneurs. They will have ZERO incentive to expand their businesses if every extra penny they make is then taken from them by an outside force

2. Millionaires and billionaires will simply leave the country along with all of their money and wealth and invest it elsewhere. There's a term for this, capital flight, that is found primarily in left-leaning nations (only makes since as it is left-leaning countries that target their wealth). This can lead to a currency collapsing and the brain drain that results will destroy the nation (just take a look at Puerto Rico [not a country] or Venezuela [china has also experienced this])

You can't multiply wealth by dividing it

exactly

كتب بواسطة Al Fappino, 09.06.2017 at 16:05

Remember Spain for the whole of 2016 and a part of 2017 with a Conservative management government all over again? It'll happen exactly the same in Britain and in the end, Britain will have another Conservative government, just like in Spain.
Unless Labour turns a bit right, they'll just keep on imploding, or be a party of millenials.

I'd rather you didn't remember me of Spain... it is depresing to remember... and our real problem is the opposition (PSOE) is as stupidly right as our right wing party (PP). We don't have a fucking center!

كتب بواسطة Pheonixking929, 09.06.2017 at 16:11

Maximum wage will result in two effects

1. No one will have any incentive to make more than whatever the threshold is. Sure, you could argue they could invest more, maybe raise wages, etc. but for th most part they will simply stop caring, especially entrepreneurs. They will have ZERO incentive to expand their businesses if every extra penny they make is then taken from them by an outside force

2. Millionaires and billionaires will simply leave the country along with all of their money and wealth and invest it elsewhere. There's a term for this, capital flight, that is found primarily in left-leaning nations (only makes since as it is left-leaning countries that target their wealth). This can lead to a currency collapsing and the brain drain that results will destroy the nation (just take a look at Puerto Rico [not a country] or Venezuela [china has also experienced this])

You can't multiply wealth by dividing it

Wage is what you're paying your employees, not the money you can make with your company

كتب بواسطة RaulPB, 09.06.2017 at 17:19

كتب بواسطة Pheonixking929, 09.06.2017 at 16:11

Maximum wage will result in two effects

1. No one will have any incentive to make more than whatever the threshold is. Sure, you could argue they could invest more, maybe raise wages, etc. but for th most part they will simply stop caring, especially entrepreneurs. They will have ZERO incentive to expand their businesses if every extra penny they make is then taken from them by an outside force

2. Millionaires and billionaires will simply leave the country along with all of their money and wealth and invest it elsewhere. There's a term for this, capital flight, that is found primarily in left-leaning nations (only makes since as it is left-leaning countries that target their wealth). This can lead to a currency collapsing and the brain drain that results will destroy the nation (just take a look at Puerto Rico [not a country] or Venezuela [china has also experienced this])

You can't multiply wealth by dividing it

Wage is what you're paying your employees, not the money you can make with your company

Corbyn has also described it as a "maximum earnings limit." This will certainly affect anyone at a public company/corporation (their salary is counted as wage). For private businesses, this would (almost) certainly apply, Corbyn is going after the upper class, not trying to deal with wages of those in the lower (he makes about 180k pounds a year and has said his maximum wage would be "slightly more than that")

Strong support for the Conservatives in the AtWar community, it seems. No real surprise there.

كتب بواسطة Pheonixking929, 09.06.2017 at 16:11

You can't multiply wealth by dividing it

Yes, yes. You definitely can multiply wealth by dividing it. Especially in a recession.

Maximum wage is still a silly idea, though.

كتب بواسطة Al Fappino, 09.06.2017 at 16:05

Unless Labour turns a bit right, they'll just keep on imploding, or be a party of millenials.

I suspect the opposite. If Labour swings right, they're doomed to be a party of millennials.

There is a very strong sense of disillusionment in Europe with the mainstream social-democratic parties. If the social-democratic parties keep focused on various social issues and internationalist tolerance instead of the real issues that people actually care about, they're doomed.

There seems to be a very strong sense in the working class and the lower middle class that the government and those elite politicians don't care about them anymore. The leftist parties can and should capitalise heavily on this sentiment, and that means adopting economic left-wing policies that connect directly to people's immediate quality of life.

كتب بواسطة RaulPB, 09.06.2017 at 17:16

I'd rather you didn't remember me of Spain... it is depresing to remember... and our real problem is the opposition (PSOE) is as stupidly right as our right wing party (PP). We don't have a fucking center!

You don't have a Center-leaned party because PP is your center-right party of your Political Life. PSOE is constantly trying to occupy the Center but they can't because if they turn to the right, they'll make their left-leaned electorate hostile to them, which then will make them turn to radical populist parties like you now have, with the Podemos or the Ciudadanos and shit, which are basically 2 fuckhead of parties who messed up with Spanish Political Mainstream-situation, and doomed PSOE to irrelevancy, until they form a consistent party, and a consistent opposition to a half-corrupt right-wing party and manage to get the leftist electorate to vote PSOE and not Podemos. At this point, Podemos will be the true opposition lolz

كتب بواسطة International, 09.06.2017 at 23:14

There seems to be a very strong sense in the working class and the lower middle class that the government and those elite politicians don't care about them anymore. The leftist parties can and should capitalise heavily on this sentiment, and that means adopting economic left-wing policies that connect directly to people's immediate quality of life.

You can't have left-wing economic policies implemented if you don't have an economical structure for that. If they were to hardcore implement it, like Corbyn wants, they'd just bury Britain in 3 years into a deep Recession. There's no such thing as left-wing economic policies. You can't go for the extremes, you need to have financial vitality and consciousness in order to give people a better life quality.

I dont even know to be honest

Anything Liberal is fucking bad they destroy economies while conservatives have to rebuild them

كتب بواسطة Cheerfultitanic, 10.06.2017 at 19:42

Anything Liberal is fucking bad they destroy economies while conservatives have to rebuild them

Great Depression
Bush recession

but it's okay go ahead and ignore those.

كتب بواسطة Cheerfultitanic, 10.06.2017 at 19:42

Anything Liberal is fucking bad they destroy economies while conservatives have to rebuild them

Not british liberals, the opposite applies. Conservatives are almost as economically insane as socialists.

كتب بواسطة Pheonixking929, 09.06.2017 at 11:58

Which party do you support?

Conservatives/Tories- Largest party in Parliament and originallly seen as potentially the only viable party after Brexit. Many, including myself, saw a "one party state" arising due to a lack of opposition. Tories today are keen on Brexit (but split between a "soft" or "hard" brexit) and Theresa May's time as PM might come to an end if and when her minority government falls apart (I suspect by the end of the year).

Labour- Jeremy Corbyn basically did a hostile takeover of this party bringing in tens o thousands of new voters and pushing it the the far left. They are calling for nationalizing industries and railways, a maximum wage, increasing the minimum wage, etc

Liberal-Dems: insignificant little buggers. They are basically Labour. When labour goes center-left, Liberal gems go far left, and vice versa. They maintained a coalition government with Camerons government but were later decimated in the 2014 general elections

UKIP- Brexiteers basically. UKIP has lost all of its seats now, most voters have flocked to the Tories. Its leader has resigned today

SNP- Basically Labour who want Scotland to be an independent party

DUP- an Irish Unionist party now in coalition with the Tories.

Sinn Féin- Irish Nationalist party that came close to having a majority in their devolved parliament.


****I will add more information on this, I am just busy right now but want to ge a jump start on this****

I'm going to go ahead and not take this post seriously.

كتب بواسطة Al Fappino, 10.06.2017 at 16:14

You don't have a Center-leaned party because PP is your center-right party of your Political Life. PSOE is constantly trying to occupy the Center but they can't because if they turn to the right, they'll make their left-leaned electorate hostile to them, which then will make them turn to radical populist parties like you now have, with the Podemos or the Ciudadanos and shit, which are basically 2 fuckhead of parties who messed up with Spanish Political Mainstream-situation, and doomed PSOE to irrelevancy, until they form a consistent party, and a consistent opposition to a half-corrupt right-wing party and manage to get the leftist electorate to vote PSOE and not Podemos. At this point, Podemos will be the true opposition lolz

PP is right wing.
PSOE is right or center-right wing.
Podemos is the new left wing.
Ciudadanos is PP's bitch (right wing).

Podemos and ciudadanos didn't mess up anything, they brought more possibilities which is what Spain basically needed. PSOE only was relevant cause there were no relevant left wing parties and cause their stupidity was still to be revealed, as it has happened these last few months. Btw, for now, PSOE and PP have been proven to be corrupt. Ciudadanos is under investigation. Podemos has yet been proved to not be corrupt in the trials.

Why do you have this negative view on Podemos? Much media I guess

we all know who won

كتب بواسطة RaulPB, 10.06.2017 at 22:46

كتب بواسطة Al Fappino, 10.06.2017 at 16:14

You don't have a Center-leaned party because PP is your center-right party of your Political Life. PSOE is constantly trying to occupy the Center but they can't because if they turn to the right, they'll make their left-leaned electorate hostile to them, which then will make them turn to radical populist parties like you now have, with the Podemos or the Ciudadanos and shit, which are basically 2 fuckhead of parties who messed up with Spanish Political Mainstream-situation, and doomed PSOE to irrelevancy, until they form a consistent party, and a consistent opposition to a half-corrupt right-wing party and manage to get the leftist electorate to vote PSOE and not Podemos. At this point, Podemos will be the true opposition lolz

PP is right wing.
PSOE is right or center-right wing.
Podemos is the new left wing.
Ciudadanos is PP's bitch (right wing).

Podemos and ciudadanos didn't mess up anything, they brought more possibilities which is what Spain basically needed. PSOE only was relevant cause there were no relevant left wing parties and cause their stupidity was still to be revealed, as it has happened these last few months. Btw, for now, PSOE and PP have been proven to be corrupt. Ciudadanos is under investigation. Podemos has yet been proved to not be corrupt in the trials.

Why do you have this negative view on Podemos? Much media I guess

Podemos party leader is a marxist cuck, not to mention he refuses to condemn Venezuela's Maduro. He's just like our communist party, wasteland, if you tell me. Nonetheless, he's the Tornado your political system needed

كتب بواسطة Al Fappino, 11.06.2017 at 07:16

Podemos party leader is a marxist cuck, not to mention he refuses to condemn Venezuela's Maduro. He's just like our communist party, wasteland, if you tell me. Nonetheless, he's the Tornado your political system needed

Ok, show proofs of that since you seem to know so much about our own politicians XD

كتب بواسطة RaulPB, 11.06.2017 at 08:44

كتب بواسطة Al Fappino, 11.06.2017 at 07:16

Podemos party leader is a marxist cuck, not to mention he refuses to condemn Venezuela's Maduro. He's just like our communist party, wasteland, if you tell me. Nonetheless, he's the Tornado your political system needed

Ok, show proofs of that since you seem to know so much about our own politicians XD

https://www.wsj.com/articles/how-venezuelas-chavez-lives-on-in-spain-1425000737

the fact Podemos is of chavist-inspiration is already concerning.

http://elpais.com/elpais/2016/06/17/inenglish/1466151454_189201.html

كتب بواسطة Al Fappino, 11.06.2017 at 09:24

https://www.wsj.com/articles/how-venezuelas-chavez-lives-on-in-spain-1425000737

the fact Podemos is of chavist-inspiration is already concerning.

http://elpais.com/elpais/2016/06/17/inenglish/1466151454_189201.html

I can't read the first one, it says I need to create an account, fuck it! That wallstreet headline is also quite exagerated and potentially misleading

Also, I've never trusted El Pais, it's a blatantly right wing newspaper, they manipulate information so often... and since you don't seem to have realized it, that one is from 2016. Quite outdated information.

Podemos is based on people that come from communist ideologies and evolved into less extremist. I don't see why would that be more concerning than PP and their "fuck the people" policy. News are so fucking sensationalist.

كتب بواسطة RaulPB, 11.06.2017 at 09:46

كتب بواسطة Al Fappino, 11.06.2017 at 09:24

https://www.wsj.com/articles/how-venezuelas-chavez-lives-on-in-spain-1425000737

the fact Podemos is of chavist-inspiration is already concerning.

http://elpais.com/elpais/2016/06/17/inenglish/1466151454_189201.html

I can't read the first one, it says I need to create an account, fuck it! That wallstreet headline is also quite exagerated and potentially misleading

Also, I've never trusted El Pais, it's a blatantly right wing newspaper, they manipulate information so often... and since you don't seem to have realized it, that one is from 2016. Quite outdated information.

Podemos is based on people that come from communist ideologies and evolved into less extremist. I don't see why would that be more concerning than PP and their "fuck the people" policy. News are so fucking sensationalist.

I know the sources were outdated, I cba to search for recent ones, but they are on the scope for receiving funds from Venezuela indeed. Besides, the fact that they have marxism as a baseline for their political movement, is already concerning. Even if they evolve into a center-left party, it'll be too hard to fight that baseline.

كتب بواسطة Al Fappino, 11.06.2017 at 10:31

I know the sources were outdated, I cba to search for recent ones, but they are on the scope for receiving funds from Venezuela indeed. Besides, the fact that they have marxism as a baseline for their political movement, is already concerning. Even if they evolve into a center-left party, it'll be too hard to fight that baseline.

They've been under several investigations already and it has been proved wrong twice already.

Marxism was their former baseline, before they formed the political party. So no, it's not their real baseline. And no, it's not as concerning as PP's real baseline...

And I wouldn't want them to turn into yet another "central" party....

كتب بواسطة RaulPB, 11.06.2017 at 11:31

كتب بواسطة Al Fappino, 11.06.2017 at 10:31

I know the sources were outdated, I cba to search for recent ones, but they are on the scope for receiving funds from Venezuela indeed. Besides, the fact that they have marxism as a baseline for their political movement, is already concerning. Even if they evolve into a center-left party, it'll be too hard to fight that baseline.

They've been under several investigations already and it has been proved wrong twice already.

Marxism was their former baseline, before they formed the political party. So no, it's not their real baseline. And no, it's not as concerning as PP's real baseline...

And I wouldn't want them to turn into yet another "central" party....

Keep in mind I'm not defending PP in any way, but your political process is fucked up, and it's gonna end up costing you your industrial heart, Catalonia.

كتب بواسطة Al Fappino, 11.06.2017 at 11:34

Keep in mind I'm not defending PP in any way, but your political process is fucked up, and it's gonna end up costing you your industrial heart, Catalonia.

Actually, autonomous comunities with strong industrial presence voted Podemos in majority or in great percentages (Madrid, Catalonia, Vasques). So your "fear" is not quite well funded. I don't think you really have a huge idea about Spain's actual political situation but yes, there's one thing in which we do agree: spanish politics are fucked up in inimaginable levels.... but as of right now, Podemos > PP and PSOE.